Little Women

• Apr. 29, 2006 - Review/Comparison: Sonlight and Tapestry of Grace

On the forums I frequent, there has been a lot of discussion lately about how Sonlight and Tapestry of Grace compare.  Having used Sonlight for the past 5 years (7 cores), and having just throroughly researched and begun to use Tapestry of Grace, I thought perhaps what I have found might be helpful to others.  (We still love Sonlight, and I would recommend it to others.  We just needed a bit of a change.  :) )

Let's start with the similarities:
*    Both are history-focused.
*    Both use living books, primarily.  (Living books are written by a single author who loves his subject, and contain  more depth and interest than most textbooks, which are typically written by committees.)
*     Both treat history chronologically, though in a slightly different manner.
*     Both use historical fiction, especially in the younger grades, to get a feel for the time period being discussed. 
*     Both also contain a huge amount of historical depth, far more than I ever got, even in college!
*     Both are written by Christians, and seek to have a Christian worldview.  (This is more overt in TOG, as I'll explain later.)
*     Both have similar costs, if buying all books at one level.  (Both can also be used in conjunction with your library, though this is easier with TOG.)
*     Both can be used with Charlotte Mason or classical approaches, though TOG  more directly follows the classical approach.
*     Both offer strong writing programs.  (SL's is in their language arts component.)
*     Both are well-suited to gifted kids, as they offer extra challenge, as well as to more challenged kids, as they are quite flexible.
*     Both give you more to do than you possibly can, so you do have to pick and choose, with either. 

On, to the differences!  :)

Sonlight:   
*   Gives you a more thorough schedule.   SL's schedule is broken down day by day, and for each subject.
*    Makes available all the books, in one convenient package (though you can also order just parts and use the library, if you need or want to).
*    Lists out for you which books are best read aloud, and which are good for kids to read to themselves.
*    Teaches world history chronologically, then US history chronologically, and has a few years where the focus is geography or some other non-chronological area.   (It seems to me that this essentially fulfills the "study history chronologically" approach, though it does not do the 4-year cycle.  It also does split US history apart, in a way that "classical" education typically does not.)   Some people really like the variety of  the years when history is not the main focus.
*     Has a greater missions focus each year.  (Every year, there are one or more missionary biographies.  They may not fit the time period, but are done as a  separate thing.  There is also generally a "pray for the world" book.   TOG seems to cover missions in their chronological place--I haven't gotten quite that far, yet.)
*     Offers language arts and readers that go along with their history program, and also offers science, math, etc.  (Their recommendation for high school is the same as TOG's, Apologia, but SL actually sells it, as well.  SL also has their own program for lower grades.)
*     SL just separated their Bible, so if you already have a program you love (or don't want one), you can buy a complete core without it.
*     SL has a very strong cross-cultural focus.  They do have several years of US history,  but they are much more interested, generally, in other cultures. 
*     SL's LA is very much in line with Charlotte Mason ideas.  (Also with Ruth Beechiks' ideas.)  It's a "natural" learning system, using sentences taken from their reading.  SL also gives you passages to use for dictation.   The grammar itself is very  challenging.
*     SL offers significant commentary about many controversial/liberal ideas presented in the books they use.   TOG does, to some extent, in the teacher's notes, but  from what I've seen, they don't seem to have the kind of specific analysis that SL does.
 

Tapestry of Grace:
*     Has a much stronger focus on Biblical history, particularly the first year.  Eg, it covers Creation, rather than just starting with the Sumerians, and uses directly Biblical  resources for studying the early years of history.  It also covers Israel more thoroughly than SL does, including studying how the law foreshadows Christ.    (This makes SL work better for the non-Christian homeschooler, at least for year 1.)
*     Offers hands-on activities most (or possibly all) weeks.  These are simple to do,  and not overwhelming.  (You can add these into SL fairly easily, but they aren't  already there.)
*    Gives the ability to really correlate all of your students over multiple grade levels.  (This is a big factor with many who have chosen TOG over SL--SL's cores don't really go together for different age levels.)
*     Has more flexibility in terms of exactly which books you can use.  This makes it easier to use your library or your own bookshelves, but does require more  planning work on your part, choosing exactly what you will use.
*     Has weekly schedules for each age group, rather than daily ones.
*      Does not offer science, math, phonics, etc, though they offer recommendations.
*     Offers extensive teacher's notes, so you can talk about things intelligently without having to read every book your kids read.   (Some people choose  TOG because they like learning for themselves, others turn away because they don't like this.)
*     Requires more planning than Sonlight.  You can't just pick it up and go.  (Though, with several students in different cores, you may need as much planning  with Sonlight, especially if you are trying to correlate them.)
*      Is more flexible than Sonlight, because it offers all the levels in one package.  Eg,   if your child reads better than he writes, you can use higher level reading books and lower level writing assignments.
*     Uses a more traditional style of grammar (recommends Easy Grammar), though you could easily substitute any grammar program.  They do recommend dictation, but do not provide specific passages.
*      Integrates fine arts and music into all years and levels.
*      Uses the more traditional, classical chronological breakdown of a 4-year cycle.  (However, TOG's last 2 years are the 1800's and the 1900's.  I think most classical methods group the last years a bit differently.)


In conclusion:

I would suggest Sonlight if:
*   You don't have time to plan, but want to spend your homeschool time actually  schooling!  :)    (This was a big deal for me, in the beginning.)
*   You don't care about hands-on.
*   You like to have things easy--tell me what to do, and I'll do it.  :)
*   You want a very strong international focus.
  
I would suggest TOG if:
*    You or your kids need/want the hands-on activities, but you don't want to have to come up with them.  
*     You like flexibility.
*     You like planning, or at least don't mind it.
*     You have several school-aged children at different levels, and you'd like to  correlate their studies.
*      You strongly want a classical style of education.

Hope this helps someone!  :)

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• Apr. 28, 2006 - Very interesting

Posted by
Which cores of SL have you done? I've done Core K and Core 1+2. I've been debating changing to TOG or Ambleside Online. Thanks for the breakdown. If you've done Core 3, could you tell me whether it was better than the earlier cores, or if you liked it better?

Have you used both?

Also, I've checked your page for updates all week and just today saw this...I wonder why it took a week to show up?

Edited by ThreeLittleLadies on Apr. 28, 2006 at 7:57 AM
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• Apr. 28, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by My4LittleWomen
I have used all the cores from PreK though part of 5, though the preK and the K were used rather informally, mostly just reading the books, rather than really going through the program.

I'm not certain what you mean by "does core three get better"? I think the answer to that would be in what you are not enjoying about lower cores. Perhaps if you let me know that, I can answer your question.

We have enjoyed every core we have done, including the part of core 5, but I was just having a really hard time doing 2 cores. (Plus we moved, then the holidays, then we had family here, then we were sick--none of these were the fault of the curriculum at all, but it made the whole school year seem very disjointed.)
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• Apr. 28, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by My4LittleWomen
I couldn't remember all your questions, so I posted what I had, then took another look. Re. the other questions:

I have used only 1.5 weeks of TOG, but I researched it pretty thoroughly first, and I have read through a large percentage of the material for year 1. (They have a good email loop, where you can ask a lot of questions, as well as their forums.)

I saved this as a draft a week or so ago, but wanted input from my sister, who also homeschools and also uses Sonlight, but has also looked into TOG. Between her being busy and me being busy, it took a week to get this finished. I am guessing that the date is given as when I began the first draft.
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• Apr. 30, 2006 - Thanks for posting this!

Posted by Momof5littlewomen
I have not looked at Sonlight but am seriously considering TOG for next year. I enjoyed reading through your comments and it has helped firm up my decision even more.

June
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• Jul. 13, 2006 - Choices of books

Posted by Dana
Hi-

Thank you for posting your comparison between Sonlight and TOG. It really helped me so much!!! I have TOG year 1 with me and I plan on buying Instructor Guides from Sonlight to compare the difference. I need to research both of them throughly. My oldest will begin Kindergarten this fall. If at all possible, I hope to pick one curriculum and stick with it throughout their years, simply to save money. However- I have two questions. Maybe you could help me out with my questions...

One, I wonder if the books in TOG are just as interesting to read as Sonlight. I am more familiar with the books in Sonlight than I am with the books in TOG. It seems to me that the books chosen in TOG are more history focused. I want learning to be fun- not dry. I hope that the books that TOG use are fun and enjoyable for kids to read. I'd like to know what is your opinion (or your kids :) on the book choices between those curriculums.

Also, I noticed that TOG is more Bibical based in the Year One, which is important to me. I am not sure how to ask you this, but do you think that Sonlight has the same focus (not necessarily learning directly about the Bible history, etc., but is good for the children to learn more about the Bible and God, Himself? Am I making sense here?

I really, really like Sonlight. I love the organized curriculums they have out there. I love the book choices they have. I love the prepackaged offers they have. Many books are readily available at the library (except for TOG's books-- I had a harder time finding them). However, I do want the flexibility that TOG has for multi-aged children, which has me stuck at the "fence" between those two curriculums. Hope you can help me out here. Both of the curriculums are wonderfull-- but I just can't seem to make up my mind. :(
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• Jul. 13, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by My4LittleWomen
I know what you mean about going back and forth. I have done that for quite awhile.

I would say that the books are different, but many are still really, really good. The "spines" are pretty similar, as are a fair number of other books. We've only done a few weeks, but the Gilgamesh books, eg, my kids really loved. What I did miss was the read-alouds, but I think that was my fault. I could have taken any of the readers and used them as read-alouds. TOG just doesn't pull it out and do it for you. The books have been very nice, though. I don't think you need to worry about that.

My sister has done more analysis of year 3, and she really liked the way some topics, such as immigration, are much more in-depth in TOG.

I do think Sonlight is lacking in Biblical correlation, particularly in Ancient history. To me, this is really key. Because SL really bases their study on secular history books, most Biblical history is left out. There is a bit about Moses, David, etc, but it's not much. I think this is one of the big strengths of TOG.

You said your oldest is 5? I don't think you mentioned ages of younger ones. I would think starting with either SL preK or K would be best, depending on whether you have another child who would also enjoy preK. Then, in a year or two, move into history. There is certainly no need to rush into it with a kindergartener.

To me, the biggest things in favor of TOG were:
1. the Biblical focus
2. the ability to easily combine ages
and
3. the availability of classically-oriented discussion levels.

I do still love the SL books, though. :)
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• Jul. 13, 2006 - It's me again...

Posted by ThreeLittleLadies
Funny you just reentered this discussion today...

I've been regoing over what we're doing, evaluating what is working and not working, looking at TOG again, and Ambleside Online. I made a schedule for us to start back homeschooling next week using our remaining Sonlight stuff, and it was tough! We aren't on the same weeks in about anything! Blah! We're way behind in Bible, because I'm using a different Bible than suggested. Jaedyn is on week 10 of LA1 (she just started the ICRI books while we were in Guatemala). Ciara has finished the readers of LA2 regular, but is only on like week 28 of the LA. I have all of the advanced readers, but the LA2 doesn't really have dictation exercises correlating with that...

I really had a hard time staying with the LA1+2 schedule this year as you can see. Jaedyn doesn't really thrive with the read alouds, and struggles with any kind of writing...she needs hands-on activities (I think). I'm a little leery of going on to SL 3 until she is more ready... I guess that is why I wondered back then if TOG is better. We really enjoyed Core K, but Jaedyn really wasn't ready for it then either. I'm in a quandary as to what to do...continue what we're doing...change curriculums altogether and get a fresh start...go back and get Core 1 and Core 2 separately and try to follow the schedule more closely (we still haven't done many of the read-alouds, since we've been going through the Chronicles of Narnia. What to do...what to do...

Please let me know if you reply to this, otherwise I might forget to come see.
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• Jul. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by Anonymous
Here are a couple of ideas I've used in the past:

1. When I was behind on LA, I just skipped dictation for awhile. In this way, I could cover a lot more worksheets. We also often did the worksheets orally. It was less burdensome for the kids, that way.

2. I didn't let my kids get ahead on the readers. Or rather, once assigned, they could finish a reader as fast as they wanted to, but they did not get to go on to the next one, until the that one was actually assigned. They could fill in the time with whatever else they wanted to read.

3. It does seem to me like core 3 would be pushing it. I tried this with an advanced 6yo and 8yo, and it was OK, but it was quite a stretch. A lot of the concepts covered, eg the constitution, are pretty abstract.

You might think about going back and re-doing core K. There's a lot of really good stuff there. Then you could use either the advanced 2 books for your oldest, or the new intermediate reader set, depending on her ability. The advanced 2 books take quite a jump, but she may be ready for that.

An alternate idea would be to take a year doing something else, eg The Prairie Primer. This is a fun study I've never managed to do, yet. (We are doing Further Up and Further In this year, to fill in a bit.) It says grades 3-6, but I think it would be pretty easily adaptable down to 1st grade or so, especially if you have a good library. The Little House books themselves are good to read aloud to first grade and up, and you can get library books on a variety of levels to cover the various topics.

Another good unit study is Galloping the Globe, a geography year. This is good for about K-4, so it would cover all your ages.

I think I'd go with one of the last 2--just to do something different, and give a bit of time for your kids to mature before Core 3.

(FWIW, I'm not sure TOG will really solve your problem, here. It is also pretty intense on the history and writing, and it sounds like your kids and/or you are getting a bit burned out by this. I'm just reading this between the lines, so if I'm all wet, just ignore me. :)

Hope this helps, a little, rather than just overwhelming with more choices and ideas! :) One good thing--we aren't going to ruin them by a year of something.

Blessings!
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• Jul. 14, 2006 - Thanks,

Posted by ThreeLittleLadies
your comments are helpful, and I hope that they are helpful to someone else. I may try to finish out what we have, and then change to one of those unit studies...I'll have to pray more and look into them more. I actually have Gallop the Globe around here somewhere, I think.
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• Jul. 15, 2006 - Books...

Posted by Dana
Hi-

Thank you so much for responding to my questions above. It helped me come bit closer to a decision, but I am still not quite sure yet! :) No matter, you were a big help. Thanks! As for now, I really need to physically observe the SL curriculum, which I haven't done that yet. So... thanks for the quick reply so that I know where to go to when I need help with picking one out. Blessings...
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• Jul. 15, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by My4LittleWomen
There is certainly no substitute for actually HANDLING the materials! :)
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• Mar. 4, 2007 - SL vs. TOG

Posted by Njobson
Your thorough analysis really has helped me. I used TOG last year and enjoyed it, but the planning became overwhelming for me. I think in future years i may go back to it. I have always used SL book lists and said I would eventually buy the program, I guess I will start now
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• Aug. 2, 2007 - TOG in a coop

Posted by Anonymous
I 've used the 2nd year TOG in a coop and it has worked well. The coop consisted of 3rd-7th graders. Each mother took 4 topics for the year, researched it and presented it and added a hands on activity to it. I must say I learned just as much as my child did and it was a lot of fun. However, if I weren't in a coop I think I'm not sure I would choose TOG because there is a lot of research to do (if you want to understand more than what the material provides). I used SL with my daughter in her younger years and we enjoyed all the reading. The language arts program I wasn't too keen about because we jumped around trying to name all the nouns, predicates, nomnatives, prepositions, etc. without a solid amount of time spent on it. We had to continuously look up the definitions of these words in Writer's Inc. to understand what we were looking for in their LA sentences. But everything was laid out for you which was great. I didn't always follow it but at least I knew what I needed to do when I got back on track. This was our experience with these 2 great programs.
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• Aug. 21, 2007 - Saw this link on the right side...

Posted by lahbluebonnet
I use Tapestry too and love it!
Blessings,
Laurie
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• Aug. 6, 2008 - Untitled Comment

Posted by Anonymous
We were Sonlight users and just switched today to TOG. Your input was helpful and encouraging considering our switch.
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About Me

just chatting, about homeschool, kids, gifted and twice-exceptional issues, etc

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Review/Comparison: Sonlight and Tapestry of Grace
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