Principled Discovery

Jun. 13, 2006

Conservatives Against Intelligent Design

Posted in education
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There is an interesting little movement going on in the blogosphere that has spawned some interesting conversation. Indian Cowboy has started a new blog: Conservatives Against Intelligent Design. With 229 signatories since its inception on May 27, it is gaining some attention. His mission statement?
Conservatives Against Intelligent Design (CAID) was founded to give a voice to Republicans, Independent Conservatives, and Libertarians across the country who stand opposed to the teaching of ‘intelligent design’ and other forms of creationism in the classroom. In recent years Republican legislators at all levels of government have authored, sponsored, and voted for various anti-evolution bills with perceived immunity, confident that those who vote for them are creationists like themselves. CAID is intended as a wake-up call to these legislators, to remind them that the teaching of evolution is not a partisan issue, but rather one of the separation between theology and science. (Read the rest here)
The resulting discussion has been interesting to follow. I'm not going to get into the science of either creationism or evolution in this entry, because, well, I doubt I could hold my own in the discussion. That and I've had enough of that particular debate and the colorful names I have been called. Dangerous Liberty touches on this issue a little. But I cannot help but wonder, what is the point? ID isn't taught in science class and the ACLU has been pretty effective at keeping it that way. In fact, states have had a hard time slipping critical analysis into their standards...this isn't teaching ID, just teaching students to question the theory of evolution. Court rulings, for the most part, have favored evoltuion over creation.

Here's my issue. Especially coming from a fellow libertarian-leaning, conservative type person. Education is not an issue for the central government to get involved in. The central government should not be advocating ANY curriculum for any school district in the country. NCLB has a lot of good things about it, so far as we are talking about school reform, but it is coming from the wrong source. These are local decisions. If California wants to teach Islam and evolution, that is its right under our nation's constitution. And if Kansas wants to ban evolution from its schools, that is its right.

Tucents provides some good analysis in his entry and the subsequent discussion in the comments box. He does a better job than I could during my week of "light blogging," so I encourage you to visit.

But this isn't just about public schools. If this movement were to gain momentum? Among conservatives? What view of homeschooling does this comment by Indian Cowboy present?

...Third, should children be allowed to be indoctrinated by their parents? While I agree that a child is the parent’s repsonsibility and (for instance) the parent has every right to keep them out of sex ed and stuff, do you not think that the outright lying, dissemination, and otherwise concealment of the truth from kids is not just as big a crime?

Fourth, mroe broadly on education. Parents aren’t saints. Children are not adults. Telling a child that his mommy and daddy are responsible for teaching him, then when he’s 18, telling him that no one’s going to help him fill the holes his parents’ shoddy job did strikes me as a bit silly. (not that i’m against homeschooling, just that there are a lot of parents who wouldn’t put any effort into it) Basically you’re saying you don’t care if the child is improperly educated for the first 18 years, at which point you’ll blame that child for the sins of his parents.

My answer? Uh, well, yes. The parents absolutely have the right to indoctrinate their own children. Whether that is in young earth creationism, evolution, alien seeding, Christianity, Wicca, views on homosexuality or Nazi-ism. Just look in our constitution. If this thinking is set as a precedent, private schools also would not be allowed to teach creation nor would homeschools. Who needs the UN and their Convention on the Rights of the Child?

And since when has the school system done a good job of properly educating children for their first 18 years? I think I'm with Tucents on this one. It is what makes a RINO (and I mean that with utmose respect and appreciation, Indian Cowboy...that's why I chose a cute little rhino and not a raging one).

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Comments

Jun. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by eyecorn
I'm not able to post on Indian Cowboy's blog because I'm not a member, but this really stuck in my craw

"Telling a child that his mommy and daddy are responsible for teaching him, then when he’s 18, telling him that no one’s going to help him fill the holes his parents’ shoddy job did strikes me as a bit silly. (not that i’m against homeschooling, just that there are a lot of parents who wouldn’t put any effort into it) "....blah, blah, yadda yadda

Hmmmmm....so, are we to just feed and clothe our children and keep conversation and interactions to a minimum? Afterall, we are big dopes when it comes to teaching our children. Gee, that our children make it to age 5 and public school kindergarten is a miracle unto itself.

Is Indian Cupboard a conservative? Where does he draw the line at what the govt. is responsible for and what we as parents are responsible for? He sounds like a government programs kinda person.

Where are his stats on the number of hours homeschooling parents put into their child's education?

This is when I want to stick my fingers in my ears and chant, "I'm not listening, I'm not listening" because I get too infuriated reading such sweeping, uneducated criticisms of homeshcooling....and spend too time trying to cool down!
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Jun. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by gottsegnet
Oh, I agree with you there! I've never tried to comment on Indian Cowboy's blog, but I did go through the effort of logging in so I could comment on Tucent's blog (where this conversation took place). Tucents did a nice job of defending parental rights, but I had to comment. Yes, he's conservative, but obviously has a unique perspective if you read much of his blog. I do not like the image of homeschoolers passed on like this...but that, I think, comes from lack of expeience and knowledge of what homeschooling really is about. I'm sure he is a victim of the same socialization a lot of us went through in the public schooles. He argues that the dismantling of the central government's control over eduation isn't likely, so we may as well operate in the system to get what we want (my interpretation of the argument).

I ask, what about principle? I don't advocate requiring schools to teach creation. I advocate allowing them the right to set their own curriculum based on the needs of the parents in their district.
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Jun. 14, 2006 - Long time, no chat! :~)

Posted by Lazycreek
I think it would be good to ship CAID to an African war zone for about a year, and when they come back, maybe they'll find that you can always do something genuinely constructive with time to waste.

Nearly as scary as our children, eh. Church... open house.... owww....

Dave says it's not just me. He can be right there, and if he turns his back for two seconds, the 8yo's somehow floured not just the pan, but also the walls and ceiling. Yep. Great.

Cat, Lazy Creek Zookeeper
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Jun. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by gottsegnet
Hmmm...interesting proposal. I think natural selection will take care of the issue for us, though. Christians have about three times the birthrate of non-Christians so within a generation we should be set to take over the world.
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Jun. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by eyecorn
This has really been on my mind as I pack boxes... It's interesting....conservative refers to conserving individual rights..Yet, the point of view conservatives like Indian Cowboy hold is quite the opposite. This must lead to a very conflicted life! LOL
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Jun. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by gottsegnet
That's what I don't get. Especially since, from my understanding, he identifies himeself as "libertarian leaning." He actually had a recent post on rights that I skimmed but didn't have time to digest thoroughly. Perhaps I shall return later to contemplate more what he is actually saying. If I recall correctly, he was more addressing anarchy and I agreed with his basic statements. I can see how someone like him would believe evolution should be taught in the schools. And I can see how if you believed creation to be nothing but a myth that you would believe it should be kept out of schools. And I support everyone's right to pressure their own local school boards to teach according to their own values...and their right to seek alternative forms of education if that doesn't work out. But if his plan were to take hold, it would mean that even the homeschool and the private school would have to teach evolution as fact. To do otherwise is defined as child abuse. His group does not just affect his chidren (as of yet hypothetical, I believe). It affects my children who I have removed from the public education system.
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Jun. 14, 2006 - Untitled Comment

Posted by gottsegnet
ooh. And while I'm going on this, what is the big insurmountable disadvantage to homeschooling? Socialization? Because we homeschoolers don't expose our children to a broad range of ideas and thoughts? So what is it when the government makes it illegal to do so?
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