If you want to cause a stir and make people angry, yell "fire!" in a crowded theater when there is none. If you want to multiply that ruckus, start speaking of the virtues of John Calvin on any typical evangelical radio talk show. But if you really want to make people believe that you have lost your mind, toss this hand grenade into a crowd: recreational dating is sinful.Very little stirs up the wrath of the "cultural Christian" more than taking a stand upon the authority and sufficiency of the Word of God and actually trying to live it out in practice. The blatant unbelievers, well, they already think we're nuts and usually could not care any less and will merely treat the idea of Biblical courtship with typical contempt and repulsion. At least they are behaving consistently with their profession of faith (or lack thereof). But those who claim to live for Christ, yet embrace the worldly practices of dating and flirting, these are the folks who will be most vociferously stirred up. It never fails.
Stand upon the sufficiency of the Word to reform, transform and inform our manner of living and you can be sure it will ruffle some feathers and get you labeled as a fanatic, a fundy, a legalist, or even one of those horrid Puritans.
But IF the Word of God is true, then it is the believer's responsibility to conform to it. Thus I will attempt to make a case from scripture against a practice that is so entrenched in our modern Christian thinking that it seems radical to oppose it. That practice is the sinful exercise of a marriage relationship, both physical and emotional, outside of the covenant of marriage - otherwise known as dating.
We who take this stand believe that the time of physical changes in a young man or woman is specifically designed by God for His glory. As our sons and daughters make the transition from boys and girls to men and women, they have an opportunity in the midst of powerful challenges. Because they are saturated in a culture that says dating, passion, lust and recreational relationships are normal parts of growing up, our sons and daughters are even more challenged because what we have all known and accepted as 'normal' is coming under the scrutiny of the Word of God as the Holy Spirit reforms our thinking.
It is clear from scripture that the practice of recreational dating and the acceptance of flirting and entertaining 'crushes' is a modern thing. No where in the Bible do we see women pursuing men as a holy thing, or men pursuing women for mere recreational dating. Instead we see the opposite: Men who trifle with lust are considered to be fools, and the women who embrace carnality are described as wicked and dangerous (Proverbs 5).
What the world calls 'adolescence' (a product of godless, humanistic psychology) is instead a specific time of preparation for young men and women. This preparation time should to be used for learning how to exercise self-control over their thoughts that lead to youthful passions and to direct their days toward growing in the knowledge of God, practicing the precepts and principles of a godly thought life and protecting physical purity. These days are to be spent wisely, under the protection of parents, in the fellowship of like-minded believers, under the security of a community that supports purity. In this kind of preparation, the son or daughter understands and rejoices that the covenant of marriage is the only legitimate and God-honoring union of man and woman, and they train themselves under the guardianship of parents and church toward a proper and pure marriage relationship.
As we rediscover the Biblical patterns established by God for relationships, marriage and youth, we must take an honest and fresh look at our ideas of what is acceptable for our children. Even more, we must teach these things to our children so that they will joyfully embrace the wisdom of God's word and rejoice in the liberty found in following God's will for their lives. This means we will have to reform our thinking on dating, crushes and flirting. This will challenge us to actually BE those peculiar people who do not do what the world around us does. Are you willing to trust God's word even if it means you will be a scandal among the heathen? Even if it means your family and friends might laugh and mock? Even if it means you will be a scandal among nominal Christians? Rejecting the world's ways does that, after all, we can be sure of it because Christ has told us so.
We know that through Christ we "are more than conquerors" over even death, rulers, powers, and anything else in all creation (Romans 8:38). By submitting to God, we are to resist the devil himself and he will flee (James 4:7). The enemy is prowling, seeking one to destroy, yet we are to stand in our faith, sober-minded and watchful, knowing who we are in Christ, and the enemy will flee from us as God restores, confirms, strengthens, and establishes us (1 Peter 5:8-10). Yet with all this hand to hand combat on the front lines, down in the trenches resisting evil itself, we are told to "flee youthful passions" (2 Timothy 2:22). Flee! Retreat, run away! What is this saying? Can it be that what is inside of us, residing in the flesh as "residual sin" (Romans 7:21-25) is far more powerful than even the devil himself? Is there something bound up in our flesh that we cannot fight or resist, but instead must turn and flee?
Yes, indeed there is something there, it is a principle, a law or a power as Paul describes it in Romans 7, that is in tension with our Spiritually tuned mind, if indeed we are regenerate. And it is how we respond to this sinful fleshly tug as it wars against the right and lawful governing of a youthful but maturing body is the issue.
God has designed into men and women very special emotional and physical passions that are glorious in their power and intensity. These emotional and physical passions are particular in their purpose and reserved by God for the building of marriages. They are to be used lawfully and in a manner that God has intended, for within the wisdom of God's design these emotions and passions bring immense glory to God. These particular emotions and passions are not to be stirred up until a man and woman come together in marital union. We see no other option or outlet or use of these passions in the Word of God.
Thus, young men and women who place themselves into situations in which the youthful passions of their young, hormone-filled bodies are awakened have no power to resist them. They have not fled as we are commanded, but instead they find themselves trying to exercise restraint. Can a young man ask God for purity in a circumstance that God has commanded him to flee away from? Can a young woman expect to be pure and honoring to God if she enters into an unbiblical relationship that causes her passion to be stirred? And, lest one say that two young people can entertain a crush or enter into recreational dating and at the same time keep themselves pure, we must be reminded that purity is not merely physical. Matthew 15:18 says that it is the content of the heart that defiles a person. Acts 8:22 makes it clear that the sinful intent of the heart is sin enough to condemn, not merely the carrying out of an intent. Jesus said that one who even looks at a woman with the intent to lust after her has already committed adultery (Matthew 5:28). So why then would we ever even consider encouraging or allowing our precious sons and daughters to play with foolish relationships, juvenile crushes and recreational dating that stir up something so powerful that we are told to flee? Why would we encourage thoughts that are wicked and defiling? Why would we as parents enable sin and place our children into temptations that the Bible says they cannot resist? Proverbs 6:27-28 asks us "Can a man carry fire next to his chest and his clothes not be burned? Or can one walk on hot coals and his feet not be scorched?" Why have Christians so departed from the Word of God as their standard for living that they play with fire at the expense of their children?
The fact is, men and women cannot enter into a one-to-one relationship, or entertain thoughts of such a relationship, and remain pure in thought. They simply cannot do it. The scriptures are clear, men and women are not to be concerned with man/woman relationships until the intended result of that relationship (courting) is the covenant of marriage (and even then, that relationship ought to be very guarded and wisely guided). Only in marriage should thoughts of passionate desires be entertained, and these toward the spouse alone. God is greatly glorified and His wisdom demonstrated in profound ways in the union of marriage, but life-long damage and deep scars result when this joyful gift is defiled in unholy lusts and desires, and even worsened in unlawful union.
We have, however, a supposedly Christian culture that says it is legitimate, and even healthy, for men and women to date, have crushes, and act out the relationship of marriage without the covenantal promise. Young men and women today desire the pleasures and passions of marriage without the responsibility and commitment to marriage. They desire to play with holy things outside of the holy union. Further, Christians have fallen into thinking that they can seek God's approval to trifle with passion yet remain pure. Its like praying "God help me to be pure and undefiled as I rob my neighbor." It is utter foolishness. The power of the thought life toward the opposite sex can quickly overwhelm, leading the foolish from sin to more sin. Activities such as dating and flirting generate thoughts of lust which are sinful before God and should be confessed to Him, but when those thoughts lead to action, another person is brought into sin. Not only has one sinned inwardly against God, but now he or she has sinned outwardly against God AND has sinned against another, AND most likely caused another to sin. The sinful thoughts were sinful enough indeed, but to act upon those thoughts by expressing them and stirring up passions in another has caused the defiling and defrauding of another. Song of Solomon 4:12 describes the idea that a husband and wife's pleasures are reserved only for one another, that they are for one another, locked up and protected. Coercing, encouraging or forcing one's way into another's thoughts is to unlock what is to be sealed until marriage. It is to do violence to the purity of one's own heart and flesh, as well as the heart and flesh of another.
This is why I cannot condone flirting, crushes, or recreational dating. Scripture must be the believer's standard, not tradition, culture or even the modern church. If it makes me 'old fashioned' and backwards in the eyes of culture, then so be it, because if I have the approval of the world, I know I am probably not on the right path (Galatians 1:10; 2 Corinthians 6:15). So if a young man or young lady has come toward my children with thoughts of flirtation or has a 'crush' on one of them, the world says "aww, isn't that cute, there's nothing wrong with that, its innocent fun". I say absolutely not. These seemingly innocent acts and advances stir up thoughts in my children that they should not have until they are committed to holy marriage. They stir up passion before its time. They defraud my children of the time they should be spending preparing for a proper exercise of these passions and instead fill their hearts with stress, confusion and conflict. They encourage my children to trifle in their minds with the holy things reserved for the marriage bed, to speculate, to become aroused toward the secret things that are to remain covered until two cleave into one flesh. I adamantly stand against such seemingly innocent advances because the Word of God says to flee from them, for they cannot be resisted.
My children should be thinking of things like brotherly love and Godly obedience, how to prepare a home and how to keep a home. They should be deeply drinking from the Word of God and learning to walk in His ways. They should be learning about His world, how to read well, build things, cook, run businesses and sew. They should be making grand music and rejoicing in their brothers and sisters. They should be learning to provide for a family and how to pray, how to lead children to the Lord and how to solve problems in righteousness. They should be reading books and driving nails, opening doors for sisters and taking joy in preparing a good meal. They should be training for righteousness according to the Word of God.
Should then some peer of theirs come along and turn their mind to things that are for marriage? Should these peers do so with the approval of their own parents because 'it is all in innocent, good fun?' No. This is not God's will nor the Bible's teaching.
Flirting, crushes and dating have no place in my home and with my children, and I expect my brothers and sisters to honor my stand on the Word out of simple Christian charity. Though my brethren may disagree with me, I do not believe they can do so from scripture. I do not expect all of Christendom to come along side me on this culturally radical position, as evidenced by the gasps of horror and cries of "Puritanical over-protection" that come from those who claim Christ but live like the world. But I do encourage my brothers and sisters in Christ, who honor His Word and are seeking to reform all aspects of life according to the Word, to consider the great joy and good fruit that will be manifest in our childrens' lives when they are joined together in pure marriages. Those few among us today who have lived this once normal but now radical Christian youth testify of the great joys of obedience to the Word, and affirm that God's ways are rewarding beyond measure.
Further Study
Please take time to enjoy the following sermons and discussions on this touchy subject. Most of these are from Paul Washer, one of the few preaching on this topic consistently and with clarity:
- Paul Washer- Dating Sermon (part 1 of 2): Biblical Views, not American Standards
- Paul Washer - Dating Sermon (part 2 of 2): Questions and Answers Session - Tough Question from College Students
- Dr. Voddie Bachaum and Paul Washer - College Conference - Q & A Part 1
- Dr. Voddie Bachaum and Paul Washer - College Conference - Q & A Part 2
- Paul Washer - Biblical Manhood Part 1
- Paul Washer - Biblical Manhood Part 2
- Paul Washer - Raising the Bar Part 1 - Sons
- Paul Washer - What It Takes to Be a Man (Student Discipleship Weekend)
Other resources for further study:
Onions
9 comments:
Question: Would you allow one of your children to associate with Mary Magdalene? Be honest. If you didn't know who she was, I would bet my bottom nickel you wouldn't let one of your teenaged/young adult children to be within 100 yards of her. Yet, SOMEHOW, the Lord loved her and was a friend to her in a one-to-one relationship.
Below are some other counterpoints to what you waxed theological:
"But those who claim to live for Christ, yet embrace the worldly practices of dating and flirting, these are the folks who will be most vociferously stirred up" - What an arrogant thing to say. You have no Lord-given right to judge whether someone is CLAIMING to be livng with Christ.
"No where in the Bible do we see women pursuing men as a holy thing, or men pursuing women for mere recreational dating. Instead we see the opposite: Men who trifle with lust are considered to be fools, and the women who embrace carnality are described as wicked and dangerous" - You have taken an horrifically awful assumption that male and female can not interact without going straight to lust.
"What the world calls 'adolescence' (a product of godless, humanistic psychology) is instead a specific time of preparation for young men and women." - 'Godless, humanistic psychology?' Are you joking? How can you 'prepare' them for changes in their bodies? Again, this is either an ignorant or arrogant comment.
"Are you willing to trust God's word even if it means you will be a scandal among the heathen? ? Even if it means you will be a scandal among nominal Christians? -I don't agree with your ideas. Am I a nominal Christian? If so, please let me know from whom you can make this judgement, but it is NOT from the Great REDEEMER. Again, arrogance.
'Yet with all this hand to hand combat on the front lines, down in the trenches resisting evil itself, we are told to "flee youthful passions" Flee! Retreat, run away! What is this saying? Can it be that what is inside of us, residing in the flesh as "residual sin" is far more powerful than even the devil himself? Is there something bound up in our flesh that we cannot fight or resist, but instead must turn and flee?" - For man alone, yes, this is impossible. But with Him ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE.
"Why would we as parents enable sin and place our children into temptations that the Bible says they cannot resist?" - So you believe that you are more capable of protecting your kids from sin and teaching them about sin than Him? Again, all things are possible with Him.
"The fact is, men and women cannot enter into a one-to-one relationship, or entertain thoughts of such a relationship, and remain pure in thought. They simply cannot do it" - Sounds like an issue YOU have with God about yourself, rather than others. I'd like to see some impirical data into research you've done about this for you to arrive at a 100% absolute.
As a Believer, I took offense to the entire blog. This drivel is what keeps many people from seeking Him.Many feel that they simply cannot live up to the idea of what people like you think they ought to live, instead of realizing that Grace always triumphs over Karma.
I would never drop my teenaged boys off at a Nudie Bar. However, I can let them find out who they are and find the someone that the LORD has for them, instead of having a bunch of stuffy elders find them for them.
I assume 99% of the people reading this blog are Believers. The other 1% are using it as justification to others why they shouldn't seek Him; that they can't ever please Him. And out of the people that are reading this, did you date? Is your soul at risk because you did? NOOOOO.
TRUST GOD more than yourself. The Lord's protection and love, and your love and teaching them about sin, will help them find their way and HIS will. There is nothing that is not possible.
Art, thanks for your insightful comments. I will consider the points you have made and will post a reply when I can address your oppositions with the care they deserve.
Greetings Art,
First, your disgust comes through very clearly when you cast out words like "drivel" and "arrogance" and that a look at what the scriptures say (all my key points were backed from the Word) keeps people from seeking Him. Truth be told, scripture says no man seeks after God (Rom 3:11) unless they are already believers, and at that point they seek God to conform themselves to His Word. That's all I am doing with an article like this, seeking to open the Word and see what it commands us to do.
You take issue with me on several points, but you offer no scripture to back it up. You do seem to reference a few verses such as Matthew 19:26 (all things are possible) but you applied that one to the context of resisting temptation when Jesus used it in the context of salvation. If you wish to oppose these ideas, fine, many do. But how about some scripture?
You also said I have no God-given right to "to judge whether someone is CLAIMING to be living with Christ". I do not have to judge, it is evident by their fruit, as Jesus said. If someone says they live for Christ, yet do not bear the fruit spoken of by Jesus and does His will, JESUS himself says they are not His, not me. Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." A man can claim to be a believer, but if he rejects the will of the father he is just what Christ says he is - an unbeliever who will not enter into the Kingdom. So the question is not do we have a right to judge or discern a believer from a non-believer, the question is how do we do the will of the Father? We obey His commands (Matthew 12:50 For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother." ). If He gives us certain things to do and not do, think and not think, we who desire to do His will should do them, right. Those things bear fruit, and from the good fruit you know the one who is a believer.
You seem to think we cannot judge at all, but you did not get that from the Bible. The Bible commands us to expose unrighteousness and bring darkness into light (Ephesians 5). If we do not discern (or 'judge' what is good and evil), how can we obey the Will of the Father that has been placed in our Bible for us to obey? The "judge not lest ye be judged" scripture so often tossed out in rebuttal is referring to HOW one judges. He says in Matthew 7 "Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you." He warns us that the measure we use will be our measure. If we measure by man's standard, we will suffer, if we measure by the Word, what better measure is there? We have to look at this verse in relation to others, for if we cannot judge at all, what do we do with those verses that tell us to judge? For Jesus said in John 7:24 to "judge with right judgment." and in 1 Corinthians 5 we are commanded specifically to judge our brethren (more on that in a moment). So to rightly discern anything, we have to make judgments, the question is by what standard? The Word of God is our only standard.
(continued...)
Further, about judging, you asked if I thought you are a nominal Christian, and to "please let me know from whom you can make this judgement". You claimed "it is NOT from the Great REDEEMER" and professed it to be "arrogance." Well, if I am arrogant, then the Holy Spirit is too because He inspired Paul to command to specifically discern among those who claim Christ so as to purge them from our midst, but to let God judge those on the outside of the church. 1 Corinthians 5:12-13 "For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you." So to answer your question "from whom you can make this judgement", I do so from the Holy Spirit's direct command in 1 Corinthians. By that standard, by that measure, and in conjunction with what scripture as a whole teaches about good and bad fruit, we are to be discerning people.
You also said that "As a believer I took offense to the entire blog. This drivel is what keeps many people from seeking Him. Many feel that they simply cannot live up to the idea of what people like you think they ought to live, instead of realizing that Grace always triumphs over Karma." I am sorry if you have taken offense, but I have not offered up anything that was not directly from scripture. I do not profess to be perfect, but I do profess to know who is, and seek to conform myself to His commands. If that is offensive to you, you are not alone. The Word of God is offensive, it asks us to set aside our own opinions and understanding and obey the Lord. But on the contrary, I do not care whether people think they can live up to my ideas, my ideas are irrelevant. What I do care about is that Christians seek to obey the Word of God, for its standards are very high, unobtainable but for the grace of God.
And to wrap it up you asked if I dated. Indeed I did, and is my soul at risk? My soul is secure in Christ, but my disobedience to the Lord has left me with baggage and scars because I did not follow His Word, nor did most Christians today. We are seeking a better way for ourselves, our children, and trying to be obedient to the standard of the Bible. But it does not matter whether one has dated or not, our experience is not the standard by which we conform our lives. Pragmatism is never the guiding principle of a Christian life. Many Christians have sinned, murdered, cheated, been drunkards, etc. But if they say "hey its OK, we did all that and we turned out all right" they are rejecting the standard of scripture and elevating their own experience over what God has commanded.
You exhorted me to "TRUST GOD more than yourself." and I appreciate this, it is exactly what I am trying to do. The Lord commands, we obey. Even if that makes us a despised people and a mocked people, because the rewards of peace are far beyond our wildest imagination.
Grace and peace,
Scott
Using words like "drivel" and "arrogance" did not intimate "disgust". More sadness than anything else. Christians are allowed to disagree.
You never did answer me as to whether you would let your children associate with Mary Magdalene. So, would you? She was what you would classify as being bad fruit, from the outside looking in.
Christ was anarchic when He was here. Hang out with *****s, sinners, lepers, tax collectors? Get angry in the temple and go Chuck Norris on moneychangers? Telling high priests they were a bubble off plumb? No way! Christ angered quite a few legalists in His day.
I say that to say this: His love, which can not be compartmentalized and put in a box, can and does transform others. He is DYNAMIC, and not STATIC. No one lights a lamp and hides it under a bowl. Don't you think that something as inconsequential as a young adult sharing a cup of coffee with another adult of an opposite sex (withouut a bevy of onlookers and handlers) could be used by Him to win a soul?
I can count myself and other friends of mine as lost souls who were helped won by dating Christian women.
Knowing how I feel, will you purge me from your midst?
You seemed confused about how I didn't repay scripture point-for-point in my message earlier. No way am I going to use the Word of Love as cannon-fodder for a legalistic and one-upsmanship theological contest.
This is a sick world. The Enemy is working almost as hard as Him. We want to protect our kids from sin. WE can't. We love our kids, and even though we'll fall WAYY short in our teaching our kids, His love, grace, and protection will overcome and shine through.
"Sinners make the best saints" - Bono. Think about it.
Grace and Peace and Love to you.
Thanks again Art,
Yes, I am confused about how you did not use scripture from which to base your arguments. You said you were a believer, so I assumed you would appeal to our Lord since that's the only source of authority we have. He has said our own understanding is deceptive and vain. This is no contest of one upmanship. I do not use the word as cannon fodder, it is the sword of the Spirit and is our only source of appeal. What other standard is there worth even discussing?
You press this analogy again about Mary Magdalene, why? How is this relevant to keeping our children from situations that the Bible tells us not to put them into? You seem to be saying (please correct me if I am wrong) that since Jesus associated with ex-prostitutes and such, that we ought to let our children freely associate with ex-prostitutes or other rampant sinners, maybe for the purpose of evangelism?
First, Jesus is a grown man, an adult, He's not a child here.
Second, He's the Lord, He's God, He, unlike our children, is sinless.
Third, He has told us how to raise our children and allowing them to freely hang out with prostitutes apart from the oversight of their parents is not on His agenda for kids.
Fourth, Mary Magdalene was a follower of Jesus, transformed by new life, a new creature no different than anyone else who is in Christ.
So the analogy breaks down at the start by saying if a sinless, unique, grown man who happens to be God can do it, then its OK for us to allow our young, tender children to do it who are immature in the faith and still growing in wisdom under the Biblical protections commanded for them, even though scripture tells us just the opposite. By that logic we can justify any disobedience. There is no analogy there.
But since you asked again, my children HAVE associates with ex-prostitutes who have been redeemed by Jesus Christ, in fact my son interviewed one last year in our home. She is a precious sister in Christ, a missionary in the field, and doing the work of the Lord. Does it matter what her sins were when she was not in Christ? All sin is an abomination to the Lord. But the issue is not whether one is a rank sinner or not, the command of the Lord is to flee lust, do not give even the appearance of impropriety, and to seek after His Kingdom first and His righteousness. If we reject what He has commanded, he says we are not His own.
Blessings to you, friend,
Scott
I have a question. I am learning about "courting" from some very dear friends of mine. But I wonder, where does this concept that "Casual Dating Should Never Happen" leave me?
I am a 38 year old widow. You can imagine my chagrin a few days after my husband's funeral when, seeking relief, I looked up verses pertaining to widowhood and found 1 Timothy 5:3-16!
How am I supposed to greet this admonition? How am I supposed to accomplish it?
justkellyhere, Greetings to you, sister.
I hope you will allow me to gently point out that the context of this article is in regards to children under their parent's upbringing. I am also hesitant to give specific 'advice', not knowing your particular situation and not being your pastor. I can say in general, however, that I believe the Bible teaches us that recreational dating is not a scriptural allowance for any believer because its aim is not marriage, its aim is mere recreation. Mature Christian friendships are certainly worthy, and in a healthy church or community of believers godly men and women can and do fellowship in healthy contexts.
If we are seeking to conform to God's Word in all areas of life, including difficult ones that are often painful, will not God, who is faithful beyond measure, reward that desire to be obedient to Him with richness? Either in an outwardly blessed marriage relationship or in a more inward contented peace?
Practically speaking, if we desire to be above reproach in our walk with God, we should seek wise counsel from our spiritual elders (elders in wisdom and faith - wise, godly women, i.e. Titus 2) and from the elders of our church on just how to enter into various relationships. My personal conviction is that such counsel would lovingly seek to establish some means of protection and oversight for all involved.
Grace and peace,
Scott
Just a quick note to say that the Christian's supreme desire in any relationship, situation, or dilemma is to be joyfully obedient to God and His revealed will. Its one thing to look to scripture for what we ought to do in relationships or in parenting our children, but if the motivation to do so is merely to "do it right", then we have larger issues to tackle first. The joy of reforming our lives and conforming them to scripture follows being solidly awed by the grace of God. Our motivation should be to bring all things into submission to the will of God joyfully and with heartfelt thankfulness and worshipful devotion to the One who saved sinners like us. The truly humble, contrite heart eagerly embraces Biblical ways to please God that seem outlandish to the unbeliever and nominal Christian, but those not grounded in a total dependence upon God will only find such things difficult and frustrating, soon mislabeling them "legalism".